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habituation

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Reply with quote  #16 
I have not the background on any of this, and wish I could offer some insight, but I really need to catch up with the events as they unfold. I will do as much research and media reading as I can with this. I will need to take this in stride with every other case because somehow to me it reads like a well put together book with chapters that describe each crime spree as something separate, yet something quite the same. And, it runs in tandem as a person's life would...
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Reply with quote  #17 
Sorry Nanette, I got a little out of step. I re-read the Donald Wolfe book, "The Black Dahlia Files", "The Mob, the Mogul and the Murder That Transfixed Los Angeles". It's an easy read, not real long and very cool. I highly recommend it. Hey, it's a hell of a lot easier than reading those Karr/Tracey emails.

In that book, he doesn't go much into what others have reported, that being the business about E.Short's fixation with the Degnan case etc. He also doesn't comment too much on the "going to Chicago with Jack" business. He tends to follow Gilmore's lead that the "Jack" in question is Jack Anderson Wilson, however; Wilson didn't match the description of the Chicago policeman said to have been in her company at the time in question. Wilson did somewhat match the description given in the Bauerdorf case. Furthermore, Wilson wasn't a very articulate person, you get the impression that Wilson wasn't very smart.

He makes a verbatim quote of a taunting phone call from the killer, which is very interesting. The whole aspect of that and the other taunting documents is something he doesn't comment much on, where as, you and I see those things as being much more pivotal.

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Reply with quote  #18 
The accounts of it being a "Jack" at all could very well be a mere coincidence. Handwriting made my decision on this case long before I had any background. This is why I don't understand other's belief in the science. DK told me I was wrong at first, but then he was quickly on board after doing some research into what I was saying. Is it a happenstance that I made a handwriting connection before knowing about "Jack", "train to San Diego", "fixation on Chicago Lipstick Murders", "doing some modeling with Jack", "ending up in Florida where another lover's lane murder takes place", or any other of the many coincidences that keeps pointing to Jack Tarrance? I think not... I haven't wavered on my opinion since the day I gave it.
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Reply with quote  #19 
I hear you on all of that. The documents in the Dahlia case have the JT nuance clues too as well as the cryptic messages, time/date stamps, letters to the editor, taunting calls, the little game with the Ed Burns thing, victim on display, the phrases: "Heaven is Here",  "He is Next". Because it's an early in his life killing, I think he was a lot more cautious than he was at the end of the Zodiac killer era. I know it sounds crazy, but I think he laid the body sections out to form his initials.

One of the reporters first on the scene said he closed hers eyes, he may also have moved her upper arm. He may have also; moved her head. JBR's arms and head found in the same exact position. All Zodiac Jack 101, as you know.

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Reply with quote  #20 
Nanette, just for the heck of it, I did a Google Earth search of the cemetery that E.Short is buried in, it's kinda interesting. I was wondering if I could glean any information from it? I first checked out the site map for that place. I noticed how close she's buried near the millionaire's row. It looks like they have the hill she's on, perhaps blocked off? Maybe they charge admission?

Donald Wolfe's book indicated that the police suspected that E.Short's remains were kept on ice, prior to placement on Norton. I can't remember if I already pointed that out.

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Reply with quote  #21 
I have heard that JT positioned BD facing the Constellations in Arizona, and that it looked like his initials, and it may just be how she landed. No one will ever know this fact I'm sure. Just like I would tell Catseye that we have no way of knowing the true motive behind these killings, and cannot bear the time guessing why if we can't even conclude he did.... It's starting to sound like there is more than one aspect to these cases other than a random serial killer.

I still haven't seen any positions of JBR first off, but I do not believe any pics were taken of her in the basement as Mr. Ramsey carried JBR upstairs, so what is it that you are looking at that can specifically determine her pose in the basement?

I didn't hear about the kept on ice part, but wouldn't surprise me. She was completely blood drained by the pics of the dump site, and freezing the meat is done right after in a rancher's life AKA Jack Tarrance.

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Reply with quote  #22 
You can read in the John Ramsey depositions that he found JonBenet with her arms above her head at right angles at the elbows, her head turned to her left and that her legs were only partially covered. How here legs were positioned and whether she was placed "spread eagle" is something that  hasn't been revealed to the public. Some people have written that she was placed in a manner with her crotch exposed but I can't confirm that.

I'll probably read the Donald Wolfe book a third time, viewed from a different angle.

All of the heinous female murders around LA, like BD,  seemed to have ended after Bugsy Siegel was shot, at least until the 60's anyway. That is what's claimed in Wolfes' book.

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Reply with quote  #23 

It's almost as if they were the babes of the underground or something. Zodiac heavily refers to underground organizations and this may have been where he got involved with the wrong people, but I think that some of his kills were not ordered as well which is what convolutes the case. It's as if what I have been saying all along that someone recognized a special skill JT had through what he had already done and used his services on many occasions.


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Reply with quote  #24 
Here's a line of reasoning that I have in mind: Siegel was a Jewish mobster, Dragna was Sicilian/Italian as was most of the Chicago syndicate. The Jewish mob and the Italian mob were usually rivals. Detroit was and perhaps is, a Jewish mob stronghold despite what the Jewish mob would have everyone believe. (BTW, I'm not antisemitic, I just tell it like I see it.) Most of the dirty book stores were operated by Jews, that's a fact. Those same stores would have been a hub for the distribution of kiddie porn and snuff literature, we're talking long before the internet. All gangs have their operatives and fixers, some are much more sophisticated than others. I share the view that the Black Dahlia murder was the work of the Siegel gang, I think they involved an abortion doctor and Zodiac Jack. Siegel was trying to shake down some rich people and undermine the LA syndicate and it all backfired on him, especially after he flipped out on his Chicago mob girlfriend, Virginia Hill, and broke her nose, he was shot in her home soon afterwords. All seemed quiet till the Zodiac era, then a very similar MO emerges, but you have to be a student of these cases to follow and apply this line of reasoning.  Zodiac Jack probably had to clear all of his killings with his superiors. This is just a "theoretical" line of reasoning.

Even Charles Manson announced that "the family gets what the family wants" meaning the main syndicate and not the Manson family. He could have been lying, but the story is that LaBianca owed the Las Vegas people some gambling money, and Charlie was sent to settle the score. Also he was sent to settle a score with someone at the Tate residence having to do with a drug debt.

Personally, I've always wanted a paternity DNA test done of Sharon Tates fetus. Polansky is a pedophile and generally a low life person. There are pictures of Jay Sebring and a very pregnant Tate in her back yard, where Sebring is sporting a hard-on in his shorts, all taken shortly before the murders. BTW, I liked Bugliosi till he gave his take on the Kennedy assassination, the Zapruder (sp)film proves a conspiracy, so does the testimony of the Dallas doctors as to where the hole was in Kennedy's head. Bugliosi has been all wet on the Ramsey case as well.

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Reply with quote  #25 
DK always wanted to interview Manson. And for some reason, in the middle of all the Z communications, I felt there was some acquaintance or affiliation with these people and some other underground activities occurring during that time frame. Something feels like I made note of an instance that reminded me of Manson for some reason, but that is another tidbit I will have to lookup.

The drug thing rings in with Tim Miller who claimed to have been heavily into drugs when his daughter was killed. I don't think so much to the degree of a user as most would mean if they indicated they were heavy into drugs. I think more on the sales of such and use of course, but more the line of supplying. I wonder what JW was doing when his son was taken??? And, Klaas' father for that matter. It seemed that JMK tried to have a line of communication with Richard Davis for some reason. Maybe from the same area and known to each other is one of my thoughts, but known by JT as well??? Why didn't Davis respond to JMK???

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Reply with quote  #26 
I discovered a Black Dahlia era headline that read: "Set Murder Watch for Dahlia Killer". Zodiac Jack 101, all the way!
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Reply with quote  #27 
I think that I need to get back to the beginning and start from there... Thanks for the reminder TerryB!
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Reply with quote  #28 
Yeah, I'd like to have all of the newspaper articles from the Black Dahlia era.
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Reply with quote  #29 
That would be amazing... All the articles I come across are almost impossible to read which I don't understand. Why bother scanning them if you are going to make them microscopic and crappy as can be?
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Reply with quote  #30 
I'll check my new links, I found some articles that were copied properly. These were all new to me.
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